40S&W becoming obsolete?

Nate762

Established Member
Dec 4, 2021
63
23
Muscle Shoals
Do you think 40S&W is becoming obsolete with all the ballistic advancements in 9mm?
 

RandallC

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Dec 26, 2015
1,728
1,199
Birmingham Al
I don’t think so, I know a lot of people that like and carry the 40 as well as police departments use the 40. It’s not my preferred round.

If everyone goes to 9mm or the 45 you will still be able to find 40 but the price will be inflated more then it is at the moment.
 

Dfalt

Established Member
Mar 13, 2021
786
929
Troy, AL
.40S&W doesn't really do anything better than either modern 9mm or .45 and as far as I'm aware a lot of departments are moving away from it. I wouldn't go out of my way to buy a new one but if you already own one I wouldn't be to worried about replacing it either.
 

RandallC

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Dec 26, 2015
1,728
1,199
Birmingham Al
I agree that the advancements of 9mm and 45 are making 40 caliber not as wanted but plenty of people still like and use the 40 caliber. I was turned off from the snappy, recoil and cost per round.

Velocity:
9mm - 1150
40 - 919
*depends on grain


Price today
9mm Winchester white box 115gr 50 rounds about 18-20 depending on store

40cal Winchester white box 180gr 50 rounds
Anywhere from 30-40 depending on store.
 

mbelcher987

Established Member
Dec 12, 2021
14
18
birmingham
The FBI went back to 9mm. Most police departments are also going back to 9mm. Obsolete, no, but dying eventually. Sure. A lot of people bought LEO surplus 40sw guns and there will be a need for 40sw for a long time. If you have any 40sw handguns you want to keep forever buy a 9mm slide + barrel + magazine online somewhere.
 

A S Parker

Established Member
Nov 8, 2020
87
67
North Alabama
Do I own a 40? No! Do I plan on buying a 40? No! Is it obsolet? No! It will kill the shit out of someone.

The bullet and powder advancements can also be applied to the 40. So that is a wash. The 40 just has more recoil, less capacity and a higher cost than its 9mm counterparts.

The same arguments can be made against the 45. Here is my thoughts on what matters. Shot placement! A correct shot will be lethal with any of these rounds. If you have a pistol, you need to be training/practicing.
 

Frank Thompson

Veteran Army & Air Force
Premium Member
Feb 14, 2017
150
181
Auburn, Al
This is an Old question , now.....I like the 40SW , 30 years ago the FBI changed to the 40SW, after the infamous Miami shootout of 1986 where the FBI, at that time and place, were on the 'weak' side when the dust settled. They made changes and one was to change to the 40SW as their standard round.....Now , they use the
modern 9MM ammo. Yes, shot placement is the MAIN factor. Buy ammo that meets the FBI Standards that they published a few years ago - it is easy to buy in 9MM, 40SW & .45acp, Hornady, Winchester and several other make these rounds. But, 40SW will be around a long time!
(If interested, the Miami shootout of '86 is easy to find on YouTube.)
 

mbelcher987

Established Member
Dec 12, 2021
14
18
birmingham
This is an Old question , now.....I like the 40SW , 30 years ago the FBI changed to the 40SW, after the infamous Miami shootout of 1986 where the FBI, at that time and place, were on the 'weak' side when the dust settled. They made changes and one was to change to the 40SW as their standard round.....Now , they use the
modern 9MM ammo. Yes, shot placement is the MAIN factor. Buy ammo that meets the FBI Standards that they published a few years ago - it is easy to buy in 9MM, 40SW & .45acp, Hornady, Winchester and several other make these rounds. But, 40SW will be around a long time!
(If interested, the Miami shootout of '86 is easy to find on YouTube.)
From my understanding, There was as much of an issue with 6 shot cylinders in the 38 speical
 

mbelcher987

Established Member
Dec 12, 2021
14
18
birmingham
From my understanding, There was as much of an issue with 6 shot cylinders in the 38 special
it was an issue of marksmanship and training. reloading does take time, but there were a half dozen officers shooting at least a dozen rounds at 2 perpetrators. They didn't exactly have dozens of holes in their bodies from the shootout.

obligatory Paul Harrell video
 

bronicabill

Established Member
May 26, 2019
34
38
Madison, AL
My preferred carry round and home defense round is .357SIG, but modern 9mm (I prefer Hornady Critical Defense or Critical Duty) is a very close second. I do have a .40S&W barrel for my Sig but typically only shoot it at the range.
 

Griz375

Established Member
Feb 15, 2021
51
32
W TN, 38105
Do you think 40S&W is becoming obsolete with all the ballistic advancements in 9mm?
It seems to have become the new standard for PDs & I know lots of guys that shoot & love it. I've shot several G22 & 226 in .40 w/o issue (other than I was having a bad day maybe)

I have way more experience w/ 9 & 45 so never saw the need to add another handgun calibre (.22, 9mm, .45ACP, 44WCF, .357/.38, .44/44Mag)
Wouldn't turn it down if you're giving one away though:)
 
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Stumpy

Established Member
Jun 26, 2020
179
126
Cropwell, AL
Another under-reported issue is that all but a few 40SW designed pistols were "reamed out" 9's. The gun makers just reamed out the barrel, tweaked springs and away they went. The 9MM and 40SW make about the same chamber pressure but the 40 reaches peak chamber pressure REALLY FAST! That is one reason it's recoil is so "snappy". This led to many breakage issues with Glocks, Berettas, Sigs, etc. The one gun I could find no accelerated wear issues were the CHP's 4006's. Since they were solid stainless steel, they could take the beating the aluminum and poly frame guns could not. I spoke with gunsmith Teddy Jacobsen of Actions By T out in Texas years ago and he warned me about the 40. Said the slide accelerated so fast that the gun HAD to wear faster. Remember, Glocks were single pin locking block guns until the 40 came out. Glock HAD to use a second pin because the 40 recoiled so much harder than the 9mm. I have never seen a Beretta 9mm 92F break a slide catch pin but I have seen a Beretta 96 do it! Got a buddy that just retired as a Alabama State Trooper. He was at the academy and the locking block in his decade old 22 broke after about 20K rounds! Lastly, the 40SW was rushed into production so fast, the SAMMI members agreed on the wrong rifling twist. It was too slow. Every 40, every manufacturer made was less accurate than their 9's because of this. Irv Stone with Bar-Sto barrels told me that the reason his barrels improved accuracy so much over factory barrels was that he rifled his barrels one half twist tighter than the SAMMI spec. That is why he made a KILLING selling .40SW barrels for all make of pistols. Sorry to sound like a know it all but as a cop for nearly 31 years and a FI for most of those, I rode the 40-cal wave in LE and USPSA and IDPA.
 

Dfalt

Established Member
Mar 13, 2021
786
929
Troy, AL
If you're going to get a .40 cal my recommendation would be to hunt down a USP. I had one for a while and they're fantastic guns. Accurate, built like a tank, and unlike most other handguns where .40 is a variant and the original design was for something like 9mm or .45, the USP was originally built around .40 and the 9mm and .45 versions are the variants. They can even be safely converted to 10mm or .357 Sig with a barrel swap because of how overbuilt they are. The only drawback is the proprietary rail system HK used which is archaic by today's standards but you can buy adapters to use standard Picatinny accessories with them.
 

Griz375

Established Member
Feb 15, 2021
51
32
W TN, 38105
Shot a USP .40 a couple of times - some of my friends have lots of disposable income and little if any resistance to 'new' things.

Yes a very impressive piece of kit but a little spendy for my modest means, even used. Add in some decent dies & the usual (a few more mags, proper holster etc) and it gets to be too much for me to justify.

Were I to win a Lotto, hell yeah.
Very easy to justify then along w/ a 40x30-40 extension to house 'stuff'.

Christmas eve tonight so I'll leave the patio door cracked so the old guy can sneak in. I mean if he's got one he needs to get rid of, I've been a reasonably good guy this year .....

I always leave Hot Chocolate, a small batch on the side and assorted sausage & cheese.

JIC he's checking this thread
smiley-163510__340.jpg
 

Blubayou

Established Member
Jan 10, 2021
41
17
Huntsville
40 S&W for life! I'm sitting on a few thousand once fised casings and reload for about .15ea well until the recent price hike in primers.......after tax .10ea thats nuts! Anyway, I shoot them through a JR carbine and a shield that I carry. It works and its affordable for me.
 

Griz375

Established Member
Feb 15, 2021
51
32
W TN, 38105
40 S&W for life! I'm sitting on a few thousand once fised casings and reload for about .15ea well until the recent price hike in primers.......after tax .10ea thats nuts! Anyway, I shoot them through a JR carbine and a shield that I carry. It works and its affordable for me.
I saw a guy last week who's been struggling w/ pistol fundamentals & suggested he try a PCC.
You'd have thought I offered indignities to his Mother.
I pointed out militaries usually taught rifle skills 1st because it's an easier/more stable platform to learn and the guy trying to help him w/ the pistol issues chimed in agreeing.
He mumbled something about having to try one out.

My wife decided she wants one but as I have lots of 9 & .45 brass plus a raft ofcomponents and dies on hand, it'll be one of those.
 

4CERTN

Established Member
Feb 2, 2016
697
613
Alabama
My preferred carry round and home defense round is .357SIG, but modern 9mm (I prefer Hornady Critical Defense or Critical Duty) is a very close second. I do have a .40S&W barrel for my Sig but typically only shoot it at the range.

.357 SIG was a strong favorite of mine for quite a while, with the added bonus of being able to swap a barrel (given, in my case, a SIG P229) to switch to .40. I became a .40 fan after the ammo dry-up that occurred after Sandy Hook… .357 SIG disappeared for a while, but .40 could still be found.
 

bronicabill

Established Member
May 26, 2019
34
38
Madison, AL
.357 SIG was a strong favorite of mine for quite a while, with the added bonus of being able to swap a barrel (given, in my case, a SIG P229) to switch to .40. I became a .40 fan after the ammo dry-up that occurred after Sandy Hook… .357 SIG disappeared for a while, but .40 could still be found.
Yeah, I bought the last 3 boxes of .357SIG that my LGS had after that incident, and it was all I had for several years. It has only recently become more available, and no longer requiring a second mortgage on the house! I need to go buy a few more boxes for range use, but "life" keeps popping up and taking my extra cash...
 

bamabum

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Oct 19, 2020
131
289
Wedowee
Please, please, please... everyone walk away from the 40S&W so I can stock up! As @bronicabill, I have Sigs in 9, 40, and 357 Sig, but all of my models in 357 Sig and 40 have spare barrels to swap between the calibers. I love the 357 Sig but often roll back to the 40S&W when the prices shift and right now, for me, the 357 Sig is still a little pricey.
 
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