Anything other than 10mm is a compromise

[Bamahound]

This is getting silly as every other best caliber post , no different than favorite ice cream flavor and why. All these points are good but a small fraction of the final answer. Yes 15rd clips in many but why 9mm? Could be to carry more ammo in the same reason as 5.56 choice and not tiny hands? The 10mm would have been better, it is a step down from 45 right? It wasn't. I'm not nocking any caliber someone wants to carry. I own most of them. I also own a 35rem. Its my favorite deer rifle and look where that got me, cant find ammo for the last 15 years. The whole world went to 9mm, including NATO. If you plan on surviving you may also need to plan on restocking at some point

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

What is silly is when you don't stay on point...Now, you just stated that the 10mm (.357 Magnum equiv.) is a Step Down from the .45acp...You're Kidding Right?...No it's A Step UP!!!
We're not knocking anyones caliber of choice...that's your choice...we're trying to have an intelligent conversation in context of said Title...Opinions mean Nothing...Only Facts!!!!! I quote Facts.... and then here comes the Comments!!!! Totally Ridiculous and Out of Context!!! If this were your College Thesis...You'd receive a Grade F.... For Failure to Stay in Context and the inability to Not offer your Comments!!!! Now here was your yesterdays argument:
Bamahound
Look at todays treats and IMO you are more likely to have a group of attackers than 1 so capacity may save your life. When these "what's the best caliber" agreements get started there's a guy with a 9 looking to get a 45 and every other combination for no real reason other than he's now a believer because he read opinions. The 9mm is good for more situations than the big guns. The Armed Forces wouldnt have used 9mm for the last 35 years if the 45,10 or any other were better. They tested all of them and picked 9mm in 1985 and many times since then
My Rebuttal in Detail...Step by Step in Context!!!!!!
Be NOT Confused!!! Get the thought of Bear Hunters out of your head...The Professional Bear Guide is what you need to focus on...He could opt for any gun to stop a Grizzly...Most Choose The Glock 20 in 10mm...They would laugh you out of the room if you tried to make them believe that 9mm had the lethal knockdown of the 10mm!!!! Now, Read very slowly and Listen....You are preaching capacity and how the 9mm has been carried all these years in the Military....and they could have chosen anything....Those are your points...Right? Here We Go!!! Listen carefully, Now, as for your argument of capacity...Let me share some Knowledge...The Weapon that you are praising is the Beretta M9/92F 9mm with a capacity of 15 rnds. plus one in the pipe or 16 total....Correct...Yes, Facts!!! Now Read and Listen Closely...The Glock 20 10mm has a capacity of...are you ready?...(Remember the 10mm is the equivalent of the .357 Magnum)...15 rounds plus one or 16 rounds...BOOM!!! There goes your theory of capacity!!! Destroyed!!!! 16 rounds of 357 mag vs 16 rounds of 9mm...LOL!!!Let's get Real HERE!!!! Now as far as the military choosing that weapon over others including replacing the Great John Moses Browning 1911 45acp...Let us NOW discover Why???? Do you remember reading above in my original critique about a term called LIMP WRISTING? Did you read what that term meant and What condition it caused? Let us Refresh your memeory!!!!
We're talking about there are those out there that will try to convince us that the 9mm round is more lethal than the larger proven manstoppers that we all know! Yeah, if you really want to believe that...They get paid big bucks to try and convince you that a 9mm can lethally perform with the larger calibers. The Truth is since agencies were forced to hire minorities (women) within their Ranks they become faced with new issues...You see someone of weak stature and Grip cannot properly hold a larger caliber handgun which in turn makes them Limp Wrist the Weapon causing the pistol to not engage Battery!!!! In other words Creating a FTF(Failure To Fire) situation which of course is Deadly!!!!
So you see the Army was forced to take on new recruits just like the agencies above that were weak in stature and not able to maintain the Grip Strength necessary for the venerable 1911A1 .45 acp to function properly...FACT!!!ie: the women were limp wristing them!!!! Fact!!!!! So, what did they have to do...Find a weapon that even the weak can operate....Here comes the Beretta 9mm in all its glory...So what did that require...That required the Propaganda Machine to Run around the Clock Brainwashing and trying to convince everyone that the new found 9mm and its new round technology was superior!!!! Get out of Here!!! LOL!!! Ask any Warrior that's been there and done that which caliber They Choose in CQC...(close quarters combat)...Lets face it...The Truth is when the Physical Standards were Lowered and you didn't have to meet the original physical criteria to enlist they had to Waterdown everything across the board in order for the LIMP WRISTERS to Pass and Keep Up!!!!

 

[kenny1773]

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[Tator Man]

Ha Sleepy, I will say this for sure when you get after it. YOU GET AFTER IT... I like it and enjoy the reading you are never lost for words. Come on. You are as sharp as the knife in my pocket. Tatorman.

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

Ha Sleepy, I will say this for sure when you get after it. YOU GET AFTER IT... I like it and enjoy the reading you are never lost for words. Come on. You are as sharp as the knife in my pocket. Tatorman.

Not as sharp as you my Brother!!!! It's just the truth is the truth and it will stand when the worlds on Fire!!!! Me and you Both are Ole Timers and Reloaders...Been There Done That!!! I enjoy your Short Quick wit and Quick Facts!!!! Stand Strong My Brother!!!!

 

[Bamahound]

Opinions have become fact but fact never became an opinion. Facts are short and opinions are long. Put that in your book

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

I linked to a pistol, discussion was about 10mm compared to other pistols, sorry I lost you

You Only Lost Yourself!!!! We're all here with the Facts in Front Us!!! The Floor is Yours!!!
The Context has been Laid and the Facts on Display!!!.Lets see What you can Do in Context!!!! Bring your 3 little Smiley Faces With You!!!!!!!!!!!
Here's your Sign!!!!!!!!!!!
kenny1773 said:
If you want to be silly and bring bears into it, then the whole discussion changes and I am going with this

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With a huge selection of handguns and rifles, Springfield Armory is the premier manufacturer of quality firearms for concealed carry, home defense, hunting and competitive shooting.

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www.springfield-armory.com
20 round mag loaded with 180 grain 308 soft points, smokes a 10mm for bear defense. Power and capacity.

Here is my Critique in Full Context of the Caliber and Calibers that we have all been discussing throughout the Thread before this Chaos Agent wished to try and create a diversion in order to gain himself some attention!!!!! Here We Go!!!!!

Hmmm....Someone is UNEASY!!! Obviously someone has gone Beyond Silly by refusing to stay in the context of the conversation!!! So I must educate them as to What is Context?.... Now, Please, Read Slowly and Carefully as we proceed!!!! Let us Begin by asking the Question What is the said Title of the Thread? The answer is: "Anything other than 10mm is a Compromise"...Correct, of course!!!! Now, in my Critique What is the Caliber that I am drawing reference to? The 10mm!!!!...Which one? The 10mm!!!! Right on Target!! Right on Context!!!! I emphasize the Knockdown and Penetration Power of the Round!!! by drawing reference to what a Pro Grizzly Guide Chooses as his Backup Weapon...Right on Point as Proof of the Rounds Capability!!!! And Oh, as Many of you know I edc a G20....So My thoughts are Not just Guess Work...They are Substantiated by Pros Everywhere in the U.S. as far away as Alaska!!!!! Now here you come in the discussion with a .308...LOL!!! Totally out of the Realm of Reality and what the tiltle and text is....Why? Because you wish to inject Chaos!!!! Cause Confusion!!!! Well of all the comments on the two pages YOU are the Only One So Far Out that it is Hilarious!!!!!! So you have at it!!...We can all stay within the context of the Thread even when you are trying to distract!!! Do you realize that every single one of us has contributed in their own way Intellectually to the thread by staying within the context and confines of an edc or hunting handgun caliber or calibers but you!!!! So NOW We Give the Floor to YOU to show us all our Errors!!!!!!!! While the Whole time you are Totally out of Context!!!! So have at it!!!!!
P.S. If you cant wrap your brain around Knock Down Power and Penetration and can't understand how that would relate to real world scenarios such as a 350lb drug fueled Criminal wanting to take the life of you or yours and your holding a 9mm vs a 10mm... or how about that psycho that has full body armor that you've encountered and there you stand with your 9?!!!!! I bet you'd rather have that G20 10mm (.357 Magmum) loaded with 16 rounds then!!!!!!! Now do you see the comparison of Pro Hunting Guides hunting Grizzlies choosing that G20 over your 9mm that you say we can't forget the advances in technology in? GET REAL!!!!!!! NO ONE in the KNOW is BUYING IT!!!!!! So.... Please Carry On and Educate us on Topic as you have attempted to do on the 9mm advances or just choose to Go OFF THE RAILS as you have on the .308!!!!!!!! HAVE AT IT!!!!!!! We're ALL EARS!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

Opinions have become fact but fact never became an opinion. Facts are short and opinions are long. Put that in your book

I've seen no Itemized word for word Facts from you...Only Short Comments....Its takes Pen and Paper to List FACTS....THE MORE FACTS...The More Pen and Paper!!!! Put that in your Pipe and Smoke it!!!!

 

[kenny1773]

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[sleepy4sureishere]

Excuse Me!!!!! You CALL ME silly and then You hit me with 3 smiling faces ie: laughing and saying you are sorry for me!!!!! Who's insulting Who? You Played the Insult Card....I'm Playing THE FACTS cards!!!!!! Take your Smileys with you as you Bow Out!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[kenny1773]

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[Bamahound]

Heated topic here. OP said any caliber is a compromise to 10. Big can opened there. I'm assumed daily protection. Then the bear was brought in. The military stepped down from 45acp, could've been to the 10mm but wasn't. Got to be careful how you type here I see now. Millions have been spent to prove the compromises. When it really matters how available will anything but 9mm be since all military and LE use it as the go to round around the world. It's all good.........................."If everybody's thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking" -Gen. Patton

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

Home | RIF.org

Reading Is Fundamental is committed to a literate America by inspiring a passion for reading among all children, providing quality content to make an impact and engage communities. As the nation’s largest children’s literacy non-profit and charity, Reading Is Fundamental maximizes every...

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Absolutely, Without it I would've never obtained my Masters....We shall continue to encourage you on your journey to literacy.....Don't give up...Don't ever give up...!!!!

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

Heated topic here. OP said any caliber is a compromise to 10. Big can opened there. I'm assumed daily protection. Then the bear was brought in. The military stepped down from 45acp, could've been to the 10mm but wasn't. Got to be careful how you type here I see now. Millions have been spent to prove the compromises. When it really matters how available will anything but 9mm be since all military and LE use it as the go to round around the world. It's all good.........................."If everybody's thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking" -Gen. Patton

It's not a heated topic...You seem to be concerned about my ammo supply!!! I'm Good!!!! I own a Glock for Every Caliber they offer!!!! I'm sitting here as I type with a G20 on the right side of my desk and G19 on the Left!!!!! I'm Good, Real Good!!!! No Worries on small stuff!!!!! I've got the NATO Bases covered!!!!
I think more about my Heavy Magnum Rounds all of which I reload for: My Mark V Weatherby Magnums, ie: 270 WBY MAG, 300 WBY MAG, 338-378 WBY MAG, 375 WBY MAG, & 460 WBY MAG...and of course my Handguns, Good on 10mm and .357!!! .45 acp, 44 Mag., .454 Casull, 500 S&W.
Again, its not heated...You see my long list of Facts!!!! All I get back is a little bit of off the wall Comments to my Long List of Proven and Substantiated Facts!!!! You and that Bear....Man, you are really hung up that Bear!!!!! So let us attempt to help you out again on the Context of the Professional Bear Guide who could choose any caliber or weapon....You see He Needs Lethal Knockdown and Penetration or he Dies!!!!!!!!!! So forget about the bear and study on what decisions the Professionals make in terms of Caliber!!!! Here we Go again!!!! Hang on and Read it Slow!!!!!!!!!!!!
If you can't wrap your brain around Knock Down Power and Penetration and can't understand how that would relate to real world scenarios such as a 350lb drug fueled Criminal wanting to take the life of you or yours and your holding a 9mm vs a 10mm... or how about that Psycho that has Full Body Armor that you've encountered and there you stand with your 9?!!!!! I bet you'd rather have that G20 10mm (.357 Magmum) loaded with 16 rounds then!!!!!!! Now do you see the comparison of Pro Hunting Guides hunting Grizzlies choosing that G20 over your 9mm that you say we can't forget the advances in technology in? GET REAL!!!!!!! NO ONE in the KNOW is BUYING IT!!!!!!

 

[Bamahound]

No one in the know is buying it? Except the most powerful militaries in the world but we have covered that as much or more than your bear. Leave it to a hobbyist to prove the US Armed Forces have made a mistake for the last 35yrs. No insults or bold letters with lots of exclamation marks, just facts

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

No one in the know is buying it? Except the most powerful militaries in the world but we have covered that as much or more than your bear. Leave it to a hobbyist to prove the US Armed Forces have made a mistake for the last 35yrs. No insults or bold letters with lots of exclamation marks, just facts

No one in the know is buying it? Except the most powerful militaries in the world but we have covered that as much or more than your bear. Leave it to a hobbyist to prove the US Armed Forces have made a mistake for the last 35yrs. No insults or bold letters with lots of exclamation marks, just facts

Obviously you just can't help yourself...YOU cannot stay in context or make a valid lucid point accordingly...This was about convincing the masses that the 9mm was not a compromise when it came down to lethal Knockdown and Velocity of the 10mm!!! Hello!!! Calling Earth!!! Where are you? So again let us list in Context my display of Facts Concerning the Lethal Characteristics of the 10mm!!!

If you can't wrap your brain around Knock Down Power and Penetration and can't understand how that would relate to real world scenarios such as a 350lb drug fueled Criminal wanting to take the life of you or yours and your holding a 9mm vs a 10mm... or how about that Psycho that has Full Body Armor that you've encountered and there you stand with your 9?!!!!! I bet you'd rather have that G20 10mm (.357 Magmum) loaded with 16 rounds then!!!!!!! Now do you see the comparison of Pro Hunting Guides hunting Grizzlies choosing that G20 over your 9mm that you say we can't forget the advances in technology in? GET REAL!!!!!!! NO ONE in the KNOW is BUYING IT!!!!!!

Again, Convince all of us that we need your 9mm in our Hands when we confront that 350lb Drug fueled Murderer that you are facing who wishes to Kill you and your family!!!!! Oh,wait, ah...well ah...Okay, We Understand that you are at a loss for words.....Thats Fine....How about you skip that one...and Convince us that we need your 9mm when you're facing a Psychotic Murderer in Full Body Armor that has come to kill you and your Family....Yeah, that'll do it...Go Ahead!!!!!!!
Oh NO, You're at a loss of Words Again?!!! Well , Thats Okay because you can just convince us that that the Professional Grizzly Guide should be carrying your 9mm instead of their 10mm...Remember you are suppose to be Convincing us that your 9mm is Not a Compromise!!!!!! Get out of Here!!! You haven't done it, You can't do it, and you Never will!!!!!! Why, Because the 10mm round is far Superior in Lethal Knockdown and Velocity!!!!!!!! By the way.....You received an "F" for your failure to stay in context and prove any valid points accordingly!!!!!!

 

[Bamahound]

The OP posted anything other than 10mm was a compromise, not lets compare ballistics. Your feelings get hurt?

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

The OP posted anything other than 10mm was a compromise, not lets compare ballistics. Your feelings get hurt?

Wow...Ah...Hello...Earth to Space...Come in...Man you are really Out there...Hope you have plenty of Oxygen....The Facts and Evidence is all here before us...You have now become beyond comical to pitiful in your futile attempts to make a valid and lucid case on you behalf...
Well since you bring up the OP...Let us Look back to my Originial Post and please pay attention to the info about knockdown and veloicity that you claim is not pertinent but Pay Special Attention to the LIKE below it left by the OP our Brother Kompressor!!!!! Please Enjoy!!!!!!

kameronm7 said:
Modern hollow point ammunition really helps make up the deficit though.

@Sleepy Said: Yeah, if you really want to believe that...They get paid big bucks to try and convince you that a 9mm can lethally perform with the larger calibers. The Truth is since agencies were forced to hire minorities (women) within their Ranks they become faced with new issues...You see someone of weak stature and Grip cannot properly hold a larger caliber handgun which in turn makes them Limp Wrist the Weapon causing the pistol to not engage Battery!!!! In other words creating a FTF situation which of course is unacceptable and most times Lethal...Now, because of this they have improved the 9mm round but not to the Standards of the Larger Proven Man Stoppers!!!!
I mean lets just lay it out there and tell it like it is...If the 9mm has such great stopping power than why don't you hear of any Professional Big Game Guides out there Carrying a G17,or G19 etc....Why, Because A Grizzly for example would eat those rounds and spit em back at you as he's eating you alive!!!!
Now, there are plenty of Pro Guides out there who sing the Praises of the 10mm against the Grizzly...Alot of em prefer to carry a G20 to other heavy magnums like a .454 Casul, 500 S&W etc. If one were to try and have the 9mm conversation with such True Professionals that are not forced into being Politically Correct I dare say they would laugh that person out of the room...Just Keeping it Real!!! Don't Believe the Political Correct Hype to cover up the deficiencies of the Limp Wristers that they were forced to hire!!!!!!

Wednesday 10:48 am

Quote Reply

Reactions:Kompressor LIKE

 

[sleepy4sureishere]

You can see it all for yourself in it's original form and context on page 2... So, once again I stay in context and Shoot Down your weak point of what you think the OP means with What I know the Facts State the OP has in his Title and what he even confirms with the Big LIKE!!!! Remember, you have failed...Grade F... You cannot answer valid points one by one step by step with facts IN Context like I have done with you throughout!!! Just like your last futile point on what you thought the OP meant in his Title when the OP has given the Big LIKE to everything that you have tried to argue against me and the facts! Game Over!!! We shall put it down again in its final context the facts that were itemized for you to prove that your 9mm was not a compromise to the venerable 10mm....

Bamahound said:
No one in the know is buying it? Except the most powerful militaries in the world but we have covered that as much or more than your bear. Leave it to a hobbyist to prove the US Armed Forces have made a mistake for the last 35yrs. No insults or bold letters with lots of exclamation marks, just facts

Obviously you just can't help yourself...YOU cannot stay in context or make a valid lucid point accordingly...This was about convincing the masses that the 9mm was not a compromise when it came down to lethal Knockdown and Velocity of the 10mm!!! Hello!!! Calling Earth!!! Where are you? So again let us list in Context my display of Facts Concerning the Lethal Characteristics of the 10mm!!!

If you can't wrap your brain around Knock Down Power and Penetration and can't understand how that would relate to real world scenarios such as a 350lb drug fueled Criminal wanting to take the life of you or yours and your holding a 9mm vs a 10mm... or how about that Psycho that has Full Body Armor that you've encountered and there you stand with your 9?!!!!! I bet you'd rather have that G20 10mm (.357 Magmum) loaded with 16 rounds then!!!!!!! Now do you see the comparison of Pro Hunting Guides hunting Grizzlies choosing that G20 over your 9mm that you say we can't forget the advances in technology in? GET REAL!!!!!!! NO ONE in the KNOW is BUYING IT!!!!!!

Again, Convince all of us that we need your 9mm in our Hands when we confront that 350lb Drug fueled Murderer that you are facing who wishes to Kill you and your family!!!!! Oh,wait, ah...well ah...Okay, We Understand that you are at a loss for words.....Thats Fine....How about you skip that one...and Convince us that we need your 9mm when you're facing a Psychotic Murderer in Full Body Armor that has come to kill you and your Family....Yeah, that'll do it...Go Ahead!!!!!!!
Oh NO, You're at a loss of Words Again?!!! Well , Thats Okay because you can just convince us that that the Professional Grizzly Guide should be carrying your 9mm instead of their 10mm...Remember you are suppose to be Convincing us that your 9mm is Not a Compromise!!!!!! Get out of Here!!! You haven't done it, You can't do it, and you Never will!!!!!! Why, Because the 10mm round is far Superior in Lethal Knockdown and Velocity!!!!!!!! By the way.....You received an "F" for your failure to stay in context and prove any valid points accordingly!!!!!!

 

[Bamahound]

On a more positive note, if you shoot USPSA OR IDPA with 10mm you will get all your brass back. Everybody will know it's yours unless your in Salt Lake City and Razor Dobbs shows up. He's a bear hunter too